Got Mold?
Mold is everywhere, we can all find a bit of mold in our homes from time to time. The tendency is to spray it with a bit of bleach and move on, confident in the fact we have just eradicated the little buggers. Then it comes back again, we do the same thing. Must just be conditions are right for it to grow, right? Wrong, read on...
I have run across more than my fair share of mold in homes lately. I have also learned that I am ultra sensitive to certain mold spores, twice I have been in a home with mold, twice I developed what I thought was a cold within a few days of my exposure. Twice my cold turned into a massive sinus infection and more, and was 6 weeks of intense illness. To add insult to injury I have developed a reaction to certain antibiotics from this. I have been involved in a mold remediation at one of my listings which showed me just how serious mold can become. What you can see is often the tip of the iceberg. Then there is what you can't see....
I had the very distinct pleasure of working with Lesley Burton-Dallas and Matthew Snow from Turtle Clan Environmental Testing recently. They are full of information and approach their testing with an eye to prevention and protecting the environment. Lesley explained to me that spraying mold with any bleach product is a waste of time. Mold reacts in a negative way to being sprayed with bleach. It actually will spew its toxins when hit with the bleach. And it will continue to live, now spreading to places it wasn't before. The better thing to use (which is also a much safer option) is Murphy's Oil Soap and a stiff brush. The detergent in the soap will do the job, and as I understand, thicker is better, so don't dilute the soap when you are attacking the mold. Lesley, otherwise known as Miss Mold, has a blog on ActiveRain which is full of information, I suggest you check her out!
If you find mold in locations such as an attic or the basement or crawl space you may have a much larger problem. I urge you not to spray the mold with bleach and paint over it, that just won't work. Plus, trying to wash off rough wood is just not an easy thing to do! And you want to know what type of mold you are dealing with. I have been in contact with "black mold" or "toxic black mold" as we lay people refer to it, or by its real name, stachybotrys. This is a very dangerous type of mold, and you really won't be able to tell just by looking at it.
Mold exposure symptoms can vary from person to person, depending on their sensitivity. I now know that I am very sensitive, and am rethinking how to show certain properties. I was given a mask by the remediation company, the strongly urged me to buy more and to give them to my clients as we view foreclosed properties. This is no joke, I can't tell you how sick I was. And this is something new for me!
If your house is on the market and you find mold, please to not just take matters into your own hands. You may be playing with fire, you may stir up the mold and create problems for anyone coming to look at your home that is sensitive. Make sure you know what you are doing, and if the mold problem is significant call an expert like Turtle Clan Environmental Testing to test the mold and advise you on what your options are.
And please, make sure you disclose the fact that there was/is mold in the home. You just don't know how someone will react to the mold!
These lovely mold photos are courtesy of Russel Ray, thank you Russel!
Andrea Swiedler, Realtor® & Liddy Adams, GRI, Broker Associate
Cell: 203.460.1775 Email: andrea@andreaswiedler.com
Swiedler & Adams, we know real estate!
Prudential Connecticut Realty, New Milford & Litchfield, CT
Swiedler & Adams
Call us at 203.460.1775
© Andrea Swiedler, 2009 - 2012
Always do right. This will gratify some people and astonish the rest. - Mark Twain
Gross! I am so glad I read this - I always thought bleach was the short term solution. Thankfully you have recovered, and are doing better!
Debi
Debi, I am guilty of the bleach trick. And trust me, it got worse over time. Now I know why. It is gross, isn't it?
Hello Andrea - Mold can be some pretty nasty stuff. Thanks for the great post.
Andrea,
I am not as sensitive as you, or much sensitive at all, but living with mold is not a good idea even if yo are less than sensitive. Sensiticity is on the surface, but it affects you whether you sense it or not.
I guess we have a fair share of mold and mildew in Florida
It's weird but whenever I go into a home with a mold problem, the back of my throat "tastes" it. I get out of their fast.
I was in a bank owned property that had mold issues. Talk about a deal killer. I have seen many a buyer run. I guess the incident in Dripping Springs, TX has put the "fear of God" in many folks...
Individual sensitivity is really the issue, not the mold itself. Black mold is NOT necessarily toxic. In fact it is most often benign. Mold like most anything is usually bad only in large quantities, UNLESS you have a sensitivity.
Mold testing, I did it for a while, is far from an exact science. In fact the methodology is anything but scientific. Which is why I do not sample mold any longer.
If you are interested in reading a pragmatic view on mold check out this article;
The truth about mold. or
Indoor Fungal Concentrations
The sky is not falling, but some people are sensitive to clouds.
I was showing a bank owned yesterday and it was infested with Mold. Looked like it had been there for years!
Mold is horrid..I could tell you some great hair standing up stories ..but truth be it can make you very very sick.....I know this for a sad fact ..my nose knows mold
HelpfulHannah
I just had to terminate a contract on a nice sale because of this stuff. Needless to say I don't like it very much.
shelton
Andrea, I knew you were sick earlier, but didn't know it was because of the mold. I know there are some people are very allergic to mold, and make them very sick. I guess mold is not a huge issue here in our market, we run into it every now and then, not often, thanks goodness.
Andrea I attended a workshop on mold about three years ago, and remember them also advising not to use bleach because mold is a living organism and the bleach actually feeds it.
Andrea, I have a mold sensitive nose, and whenever I open a door and if mold is present, I can sense it immediately. I back out explainto my clients why and let them do whatever they choose, which is usually walk away. I will also check with the listing agent to see if there was any mention of mold just because of people like you.
Andy, well thank you! Yes, mold is pretty nasty stuff.
Jon, this is a new thing for me and I am not at all pleased. Some agents are just not up on mold which makes it more complicated.
Carla, I was in a basement with my broker in a house at the beginning of the winter. As soon as we opened the basement door I told her I smelled trouble. My eyes started to really bother me and I was feeling pretty bad very fast. I ran out of there!
Michael, our office has an REO that has a bad mold issue, they are actually doing a remediation. I was shocked, but it is the right thing to do. My own incident has put the fear of God in me!
Jim, I am afraid that I am now a "sensitive" and had no warning. There are many that are, and some may never even know. People just have no idea how to treat mold, and usually end up making it worse. I do not believe the sky is falling, however I am now one who is going to be extra careful. And I am certainly going to make sure that I inform my clients NEVER to use bleach on mold.
Bill, glad I wasn't with you! But now what? Wonder if it will sell....
Hannah, it did make me very sick, I was pretty much out of commission for 6 weeks each time.
Shelton, it is not a fun issue to deal with. Testing and remediation are not cheap if there is any question about it. I am sorry to hear that.
Rita, you are lucky. We are seeing more and more of it lately. Homes along our lake communities are very susceptible, and the home owners often treat it incorrectly themselves which makes it worse.
George, I think so many people don't know this, really. I had an arguement with someone the other day about this. I was clearly very angry because the agent gave bad advice to a client, which in turn put me at risk. My poor broker, picked up her phone at home and I just lost control, LOL. She was, as always, very patient, LOL.
Ed, it certainly is an issue. I am carrying masks with me now. Of course I don't want to scare anyone, or loose clients over wearing masks, but will give them the option especially in REO's. Call me silly, my health is not worth risking over this.
Hi Andrea ! Definitely an important subject. Fortunately I have a terrific Mold Remediation company on my service provider list here in NJ, who have remediated many basements for clients over the years, who have all been thrilled with the results - many using finished basements for living space with no adverse health effects.
... better to do have it doner right than tackling yourself in most cases !
Cheers :o)
This is great info, Andrea! Murphy's Oil Soap? That's a surprise.
Andrea this is a serious environmental issue and it is nice to have a good professional around when this issues comes up.
Abdrea,
Good tip on the soap product. I will remember that. Thanks.
Shel, you are so right, "better to have doner right than tackling it yourself in most cases"! I agree!
Patsy, I didn't know that myself, but now I do. Interesting isn't it?
Jennifer, it is better to have professionals, mold can be a deal killer.
Terry, glad to help!
Andrea, I recently took a course that mentioned mould and also said that the "old wive's tale" about bleach is not the correct way, in fact it can produce more harmful by-products... He suggested ordinary soap and water and then eliminating the moisture that is the root of the mould problem...
Good morning Andrea and thank you for such a wonderful post!
If I may, I'd like to address what Jim Quarello said about 'Black 'Mold not necessarily being toxic...
He is correct.
Mold is a Chameleon and will turn the color of whatever food it's eating. So just because it's black, DOES NOT mean it's toxic! The ONLY way to find out what species you're dealing with, is to test it. There are a handful of molds that we don't want to see in high concentrations, aspergillus/penicillium, chaetomium, ascospores, fusarium and the baddest boy himself...Stachybotrys which we have ZERO tolerance for...these are TOXIC Molds and if the people who are being exposed have allergies, are immune compromised, very young/old,....not a good idea. If you have half a million spores of as/pen in your bedroom, NOT TOO GOOD! We say HMMMMMM with anything over 1000 spores compared to outside counts.
He's also right when he said it's not an exact science. Look at all the companies that use dogs and home inspectors to find mold!! When our company samples the air, it is a 'picture in time'. The results will give us generalizations of the ambient conditions that exist. Protect yourselves by only using professionals that are affiliated with at least the IAQA,CACA. Some certifying agencies are better than others. We are comprised of chemists, microbiologists, certified industrial hygienists doctors and phd''s to help protect our clients...not dogs!
However, I have seen far too many people first hand who are reaaaallly suffering due to their exposures to call them 'chicken littles'. This is where Jim and I disagree. This is absolutely a REAL problem for many people.
Remember that mold is everywhere in all houses and dwellings, and when the elevations are higher by 10 times on the inside than the outside, we know there is an active infection, and it's always due to moisture incursion. Mold is a symptom of a house getting wet.
Mold NEVER has to be a 'deal killer' when you are proactive like Andrea. In most cases, it is very easy to fix!
Thanks again Andrea for allowing us an opportunity to help you and your client. It was our pleasure!
Love ya, Blondie!
xo
Missmold
Chris, thank you! As Lesley points out, (Missmold) it can be harmful. Use detergent!!!
Missmold, thank you so much! It was my pleasure to work with you, Matthew is wonderful, he explained so much to me. Between the 2 of you I learned more about mold then I knew before. I will be calling again! Anyone in your service area would do well to contact you. Our mold find was not a deal breaker, even if the counts were off the wall, due to your efforts and teachings.
About BLEACH...
There is only about 3% bleach in a bottle, the rest is water. So when you use bleach you are re-hydrating the mold AND making it mad at the same time!
Think of mold as a little animal like a skunk...If you come along and squirt it with bleach, it will squirt you back with all his might, and if you're squirting a toxic mold like stachy...look out!!!
Face mask, gloves and Murphy's Oil Soap is what we recommend to clean non toxic mold. Leave it to professionals( IICRC) to clean the toxic stuff...
Lesley, when Matthew and I spoke about this, he asked if me if I had bleached mold before. I admitted yes I had, I thought it was the right thing to do. What do I have in my bathroom as a result of that? A constant battle with the mold, it appears in different places after that, about a week later. And I can SEE where I made the strokes across the walls and ceiling. No more bleach for me, or any of those spray products that claim to take care of mold.
The mold 'garden' in your bathroom was getting 'watered' by the bleach. By using a low moisture cleaner like MOS, reducing moisture and relative humidity in the room will help you fix this for good. Do you have proper ventilation in there?
MissMold, certainly I do NOT have adequate ventilation in the bathroom. It is a "work in progress" LOL. But we are working on it!
Andrea, I recently returned to a vacant house with my clients, and they were concerned with some mold that had been growing in the basement. And sure enough, it reeked of Chlorox, and there was the owner on her hands and knees squirting away! Caught in the act!
Pat, well, make sure your client knows to go back over it with detergent, but the damage may be done already.
What concerns me the most about this is agents who condone the spraying of the mold with bleach ritual. That really gets me going, so I will stop now... before it is too late.
I LOVE the comment from MissM in comment #21 ... very helpful info !
Thanks for the blog Andrea - this one was very insightful !
Shel, glad you found it insightful! I think too many people are mis/uninformed about mold.
Great information, Andrea! Thanks for taking the time to write this! May I reblog this?
Hi Andrea, I'm glad you are feeling better! Thank you for the much needed education about mold!
You're absolutely right Andrea, mold is nothing to take lightly. We have worked with investors in the past and we've seen more than our share of mold, in colors ranging from black to green to almost invisible, which I understand is particularly nasty as it can become airborne and therefore inhaled. I was not aware of the use of Murphy's Oil Soap to clean non-toxic mold! We certainly hope your mold sensitivity doesn't get any worse! Take care!
Andrea:
Mold is completely frightening and is something we need to take seriously. Any sign of mold and a professional company should be brought in. There have been too many stories about people becoming very sick from mold. I would not take any changes with it.
Andrea - WOW!! Is this what you were so sick from????? How scary is that? Thanks for this eye-opening post. I'm bookmarking it for sure!
Hi ANdrea, Very informative information. Too many people think the bleach and paint over it works.
Hi ANdrea, Very informative information. Too many people think the bleach and paint over it works.
Hi ANdrea, Very informative information. Too many people think the bleach and paint over it works.
Peggy, thank you! And of course you can.
Jackie, it is much needed, I was glad to find out the best way to handle it, I was guilty of using bleach. Thank you!
Pat and Wayne, I found that very interesting about cleaning it. Mold is a tough one for sure. I am glad I am feeling better too, LOL.
Claudette, it can be very serious, and people should treat mold with caution and properly.
Coleen, yes, that was what was wrong with me. I am much better now, and a bit more careful. However... I was just in a house with high counts in the crawl space and attic. I didn't go in there though...
Bill, X3, LOL, yes, they do. And I had a bit of an arguement with a listing agent recently....
Great photos that you added. I just went to do a BPO in a property where I turned around & left. It had mold growing up the walls, ceiling caved in & that was just in the first 5 feet of entering. I told the bank that they didn't need a BPO of this property as the damage was so bad, I couldn't guess what the repairs would be. They should have just called a mold remediation place BEFORE me.
I'd say with your condition that you should be really careful, that stuff can be a nightmare once it gets started.
Andrea, I am like a bird dog when it comes to mold. When we walk in a house I can smell it right away - many times the people with me are oblivious of it. Amazing. I like the idea of masks and think I am going to get some. I also have made myself sick breathing things I should get away from. Sorry it happened to you, but it does take awhile to come back to 100%. It has to work itself out of your body.